MoG bug

[NiteKilla]

ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[Lallendos]

This is where you are wrong:
MoG -is- the bug.....

[IdNemesis]

I've noticed that too, but I don't think it is a bug. You still have the MoG -regen on you still.

[Nemo_Utopian]

so mog is even worse then i thought?

/em head explodes

[Old_School]

MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[LightSide]

[ QUOTE ]
This is where you are wrong:
MoG -is- the bug.....

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn, that's the FIRST thing that jumped into my head when I read the thread header.

@ Old_School - not everyone PvP's; for example, I don't and to me the power is virtually worthless. I don't really want to be a /Regen that doesn't, well, regen. If it works for you, then I'm happy that someone gets mileage out of it.

[Lallendos]

Until someone with psy attacks pops some reds and yellows, it may be good in PVP.

[Raz_Griez]

MoG is a good power, learn to use it and you will do well, if you cant use it you just not skilled enough :p
But im not saying it couldnt use a little help, maybe just not so much of a hp hit and id really happy with it

[Roy_Lyca]

[ QUOTE ]
MoG is a good power, learn to use it and you will do well, if you cant use it you just not skilled enough :p
But im not saying it couldnt use a little help, maybe just not so much of a hp hit and id really happy with it

[/ QUOTE ]Also,flying pigs. (http://flyingpigss.ytmnd.com/)

[Lallendos]

Your apparent knowledge of MoG seems very parallel to your forum reg date. You are correct, though, in that if I am facing enemies 10+ levels below me, MoG is a lot of fun.

Also, if I haven't had debt in a while, I can thrust my arm skyward, knowing sweet defeat will enshroud my XP bar with the purple love that is debt.

I usually thrust the arm skywards, and scream "Kumbaya!!!!"

[SuperSilver]

[ QUOTE ]
MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

And here I thought trying to outdamage a /Regen's HP recovery was the issue. So very thankful my blaster has AIM and BU......and you CAN'T recover lost hitpoints. Also, so glad that they added the Psy defense back into it..... :)

[Steel_Inferno]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

And here I thought trying to outdamage a /Regen's HP recovery was the issue. So very thankful my blaster has AIM and BU......and you CAN'T recover lost hitpoints. Also, so glad that they added the Psy defense back into it..... :)

[/ QUOTE ]

QFT. If you're regen, PLEASE use MOG against me. I promise I won't hit Aim and a yellow insp along with Targetting Drone and kill you in 3 shots with my 30% unresitable damage.

[Nemo_Utopian]

[ QUOTE ]
MoG is a good power, learn to use it and you will do well, if you cant use it you just not skilled enough :p
But im not saying it couldnt use a little help, maybe just not so much of a hp hit and id really happy with it

[/ QUOTE ]mog is a crapy power,learn to avoid it and you will do well.

skip it and get a power that will provide you with consistent benifit.

for the incredably rare times when limited defence would be a better choice then EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE GAME make sure that you have a suply of lucks handy.

[Rylas]

[ QUOTE ]
MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

What's with this "It's good in PvP so don't change it" mentality? Should we just have the devs mark such powers so we know in advance not to take it if we don't care about PvP (like the majority of players)? Just because someone has fun with it in PvP (and I find it hard to believe that they have), doesn't mean the power is "useful" in PvE terms. No powers should be specifally geared towards PvP, IMO. If you like PvP, I'm not knockin' on you, I just don't think you need to think it's the "end all, be all" of the game, and that it doesn't matter how the power works in PvE. I won't be doing the same with PvE. Powers need to be useful in both arenas.

But seriously, if 90% of people who post about MoG think its sucks, then perhaps we're onto something here, and it's really not a bunch of people pissin' and moanin'. I have yet to hear someone who likes the power describe "how to use it". I just hear them say "if you knew how". Which makes me wonder. Maybe I've missed some posts, I'm sure, but the popular voice sure makes a better argument here.

[LightSide]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

What's with this "It's good in PvP so don't change it" mentality? Should we just have the devs mark such powers so we know in advance not to take it if we don't care about PvP (like the majority of players)? Just because someone has fun with it in PvP (and I find it hard to believe that they have), doesn't mean the power is "useful" in PvE terms. No powers should be specifally geared towards PvP, IMO. If you like PvP, I'm not knockin' on you, I just don't think you need to think it's the "end all, be all" of the game, and that it doesn't matter how the power works in PvE. I won't be doing the same with PvE. Powers need to be useful in both arenas.

But seriously, if 90% of people who post about MoG think its sucks, then perhaps we're onto something here, and it's really not a bunch of people pissin' and moanin'. I have yet to hear someone who likes the power describe "how to use it". I just hear them say "if you knew how". Which makes me wonder. Maybe I've missed some posts, I'm sure, but the popular voice sure makes a better argument here.

[/ QUOTE ]

MoG has been around since the start of CoH, so for the Devs to prep it as a power which is (apparently arguably) good in PvP shows what incredible foresight our Devs have. Even if you don’t particularly like MoG, you have to admit that putting in place a power that would be disparaged for ~ 2 years before finding a niche shows some forward planning.

Other reasons that MoG is actually a good power were preserved for posterity over here (http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=faq&Number=1623948&Forum=, ,,f23,,,&Words=glory&Searchpage=3&Limit=50&Main=16 23948&Search=true&where=bodysub&Name=&daterange=1& newerval=3&newertype=y&olderval=&oldertype=&bodypr ev=#Post1623948).

[Anglican]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

What's with this "It's good in PvP so don't change it" mentality? Should we just have the devs mark such powers so we know in advance not to take it if we don't care about PvP (like the majority of players)? Just because someone has fun with it in PvP (and I find it hard to believe that they have), doesn't mean the power is "useful" in PvE terms. No powers should be specifally geared towards PvP, IMO. If you like PvP, I'm not knockin' on you, I just don't think you need to think it's the "end all, be all" of the game, and that it doesn't matter how the power works in PvE. I won't be doing the same with PvE. Powers need to be useful in both arenas.

But seriously, if 90% of people who post about MoG think its sucks, then perhaps we're onto something here, and it's really not a bunch of people pissin' and moanin'. I have yet to hear someone who likes the power describe "how to use it". I just hear them say "if you knew how". Which makes me wonder. Maybe I've missed some posts, I'm sure, but the popular voice sure makes a better argument here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think PVP can be a balancer, as in ice tanks and stalkers being so good in pvp it somewhat makes up for their issues in PVE, but a power/AT should be at least ok in both arenas (IMO).

As for MOG, seems like the defense is too easy to overcome for it to keep you low on health. I notice that AVs with defense boosts (ie Mako) still regen while being hard to hit. I say, just add a big crash at the end like unstop has, so its a last ditch effort where you have to run if you havent won when its about to crash.

[Stupid_Fanboy]

[ QUOTE ]
I think PVP can be a balancer, as in ice tanks and stalkers being so good in pvp it somewhat makes up for their issues in PVE, but a power/AT should be at least ok in both arenas (IMO).

[/ QUOTE ]

what issues? Ice is a darn good tank now. The only problem I've ever heard a stalker having in PvE is that they don't synergize well with teams.

PvP should not be a balancer because eventually, you're going to have to say to a bunch of people that it's okay if they have problems in one part of the game because they are really good in different part of the game.... that they have no interest in playing.

And there's no nee to debate the merits of MoG in pve. That horse is a bloody pulp at this point. I'll just end by saying that PvP should not be used to balance PvE and in this particular case, MoG, it can't.


edit: OH, and SuperSilver, MoG did NOT have Psy def put back in.

[lastol1]

[ QUOTE ]
I've noticed that too, but I don't think it is a bug. You still have the MoG -regen on you still.

[/ QUOTE ]

but with powers like elude, when the defense is gone so is the icon.. even if you still have the -end effect going. So if the icon is still up when your defense is gone, then I would say its a bug


and plz people... he's not turning this into a debate on how good MOG is. Lets get some more post about his question guys

[Lallendos]

Back on target about the bug:

MoG sucks, and the bug doesn't matter, if you don't take the power to begin with.....

[NiteKilla]

MoG doesnt suck if used right so yes the bug does matter. I just soloed a red conned non-psi elite boss with it. Its great to run when your IH runs out and if you say MoG is only good against -10 mobs you really dont have a clue and your just bashing mog. Without IH running, red conned EB's overcome too much of your regeneration and MoG compliments IH nicely WHEN it runs out and it will run out cause lvl 40-50 in CoV is jammed FULL of EB's. Btw, just soloed Mako (one of the hardest) using IH followed by MoG. Does MoG need work? yes. Does MoG suck? Nope. Not if used right and thats a fact.

[Rosenbroch]

Just compare MoG to other Tier 9 defensive powers!

I think it sucks.

(with apologies to /Dark)

[NiteKilla]

Any power that lets a stalker solo a red conned elite boss doesnt suck.

(with apologies to /Dark)

[derrek1978]

[ QUOTE ]
Your apparent knowledge of MoG seems very parallel to your forum reg date. You are correct, though, in that if I am facing enemies 10+ levels below me, MoG is a lot of fun.

Also, if I haven't had debt in a while, I can thrust my arm skyward, knowing sweet defeat will enshroud my XP bar with the purple love that is debt.

I usually thrust the arm skywards, and scream "Kumbaya!!!!"

[/ QUOTE ]
lol lol i popped MOG and died in 3 hits Mog needs work on it

[Bowfling]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I've noticed that too, but I don't think it is a bug. You still have the MoG -regen on you still.

[/ QUOTE ]

but with powers like elude, when the defense is gone so is the icon.. even if you still have the -end effect going. So if the icon is still up when your defense is gone, then I would say its a bug


and plz people... he's not turning this into a debate on how good MOG is. Lets get some more post about his question guys

[/ QUOTE ]

Lastol1 is right here guys, forget whether or not MoG is a good or bad power, because that is illrelevant to wehther or not the icon should be on or not. If the icon is disappearing later or earlier then it should, then that should be corrected.

To the OP, when the icon is on what buff does it indicate? Should the icon stay on for the duration of ANY effect, or just the beneficial ones? Should two or more icons be used to indicate how long each effect is on? Should the other top tier powers be modified?

[Lallendos]

I don't need MoG to defeat a red conned EB. Maybe your offensive primary needs reworking.

[EvilGeko]

[ QUOTE ]
MoG doesnt suck if used right so yes the bug does matter. I just soloed a red conned non-psi elite boss with it. Its great to run when your IH runs out and if you say MoG is only good against -10 mobs you really dont have a clue and your just bashing mog. Without IH running, red conned EB's overcome too much of your regeneration and MoG compliments IH nicely WHEN it runs out and it will run out cause lvl 40-50 in CoV is jammed FULL of EB's. Btw, just soloed Mako (one of the hardest) using IH followed by MoG. Does MoG need work? yes. Does MoG suck? Nope. Not if used right and thats a fact.

[/ QUOTE ]

In the 40s you have 20 inspirations slots. Try hitting three-four lucks against those EBs and keep your Regen powers active. You will be safer. That's not an opinion. That's a fact.

On topic: If there is a bug, BUG IT in game.

[NiteKilla]

Lucks only last like 30 sec. MoG last 3 min. so if I use MoG for my defense, I can use some inspiration slots for reds. With issue 7, MoG defense should be about the same as a few purples also. Also, no one is saying that you NEED Mog to solo an EB, I just think its fun to use IMHO and it is helpful after IH drop. Also, the defense and resistance drop before warning blinkie starts and CASTLE has confirmed it via pm and its on the list.

[EvilGeko]

[ QUOTE ]
Lucks only last like 30 sec. MoG last 3 min. so if I use MoG for my defense, I can use some inspiration slots for reds. With issue 7, MoG defense should be about the same as a few purples also. Also, no one is saying that you NEED Mog to solo an EB, I just think its fun to use IMHO and it is helpful after IH drop. Also, the defense and resistance drop before warning blinkie starts and CASTLE has confirmed it via pm and its on the list.

[/ QUOTE ]

Lucks last 60 seconds. A typical EB fight with a Stalker who opens with AS should take about 2-3 minutes. That's about how long it takes for my Brute and I don't have the big alpha. Three lucks + your regen power is MUCH safer than MoG. Taking IH out of the picture. That means you need 9 slots for little lucks. Leaving you with 11 for other stuff. That 9 slots makes you SAFER.

If IH gets you through the first half of the fight then you're good with six lucks giving you even more room for other stuff.

Please note, I had MoG when it gave base defense and recharged in less than 2 min. with a 2 min. duration (meaning you could get a heal quicker). MoG was acceptably dangerous then.

They had no business setting MoG to the same 1000 second recharge/3-min duration they gave Elude and Unstoppable and they seriously had no business giving a power with a durational crash an additional ending crash.

[NiteKilla]

I wasn't aware that they last 60 secs. Were they ever 30 secs? Anyways, I'll give it a shot on my next EB although occasionally I like to see if I can solo something without inspiration use just for the fun of it. Thanks.

[Lallendos]

I don't prefer using insps either. I typically prefer to do the following to mitigate damage:

Recon
Dull pain
recon
IH
recon
Dull pain.

And that would be a VERY long fight to go that many power hits in.

[BurningChick]

[ QUOTE ]
Just compare MoG to other Tier 9 defensive powers!

I think it sucks.

(with apologies to /Dark)

[/ QUOTE ]
Like ... Force Bubble? ... Rise of the Phoenix?

[Larcen3]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just compare MoG to other Tier 9 defensive powers!

I think it sucks.

(with apologies to /Dark)

[/ QUOTE ]
Like ... Force Bubble? ... Rise of the Phoenix?

[/ QUOTE ]

Like Elude....Like Unstoppable...Like Overload

[BurningChick]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just compare MoG to other Tier 9 defensive powers!

I think it sucks.

(with apologies to /Dark)

[/ QUOTE ]
Like ... Force Bubble? ... Rise of the Phoenix?

[/ QUOTE ]

Like Elude....Like Unstoppable...Like Overload

[/ QUOTE ]
Yup, some tier 9s are good. And some are bad.

[Castle]

[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[VoodooCompany]

I'm pretty sure we all know MoG is the exception to a LOT of design implementations. :(

[Ineffable_Bob]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]
Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[/ QUOTE ]
And people said the blinking icons would make HeroStats timers obsolete. ;)

[Ustauk]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[/ QUOTE ]

As long as you're in there doing code work on Moment of Glory, you may want to look at some of the suggestions in
Scots_avenger's consolidated Moment of Glory thread. (http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=5944584&page=0&view=colla psed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1#Post59545325944584)

[RoboBug]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe it will be coded in a way that makes it desirable to my scrapper :)


probably not :(

[Cobaltix]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure we all know MoG is the exception to a LOT of design implementations. :(

[/ QUOTE ]

ZING!

[Mental_Giant]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure we all know MoG is the exception to a LOT of design implementations. :(

[/ QUOTE ]

QFT

Just fix MoG while you're at it... I'm sure the consolidated MoG thread is a good place to start.

[Mental_Giant]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just compare MoG to other Tier 9 defensive powers!

I think it sucks.

(with apologies to /Dark)

[/ QUOTE ]
Like ... Force Bubble? ... Rise of the Phoenix?

[/ QUOTE ]

Like Elude....Like Unstoppable...Like Overload

[/ QUOTE ]
Yup, some tier 9s are good. And some are bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

To be fair, MoG is a Scrapper/Stalker power, so we should compare it to similar sets, not gimp Defender sets like Force Fields. ;)

[Teklord]

[ QUOTE ]
I've noticed that too, but I don't think it is a bug. You still have the MoG -regen on you still.

[/ QUOTE ]
This may be why it doesn't flash early BUT it is a bug. the -regen is part of the CRASH not the power.
-Teklord

[Teklord]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[/ QUOTE ]
I hate this type of developer double-speak. I hear it a lot.

It is a bug when the developers make an assumption that isn't true. It should still be filed as a bug not a feature request. Just because the functional spec fails to make the correct assumptions doesn't absolve this of bug status.
-Teklord

[Chase_Arcanum]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[/ QUOTE ]
I hate this type of developer double-speak. I hear it a lot.

It is a bug when the developers make an assumption that isn't true. It should still be filed as a bug not a feature request. Just because the functional spec fails to make the correct assumptions doesn't absolve this of bug status.
-Teklord

[/ QUOTE ]

It's not double-speak, it's people ignorant of the meaning of a word using it out of context. To players, "bug" has been used to mean anything that doesn't seem to work at the end. To a programmer, "bugs" are something else.

A "bug" for programmers is when a system does not work as designed. It implies a technical error with the implementation... a typo, a misread spec, something. It's very specific to technical errors. Bugs must be hunted down and squashed. Just like chasing that fly with the flyswatter- you can do alot of chasing to no avail, but once you get a lock-on... they're easy to squash.

Because of this, it's nearly impossible to put a bugfix to a timetable. You can be searching for it for hours... and suddenly BAM! I think I got it (time to test...).

What Posi is saying is that it ISN'T something where it can be tracked and "fixed" quickly like that. There's no "once we find it, it's insta-fixed." It's a design change- a revisit to the basic concept on how something works. This is good and bad. On the good side, it can be scheduled, planned, and implemented, since there's no "still looking..." moment. On the bad side, it takes a whole lot longer to get it to the users.

EDIT... except this was castle, not positron....

[DarthMord]

[ QUOTE ]
MoG is a good power, learn to use it and you will do well, if you cant use it you just not skilled enough :p
But im not saying it couldnt use a little help, maybe just not so much of a hp hit and id really happy with it

[/ QUOTE ]

The above statement also requires that you ignore the downsides of MoG (no healing, crash, Psi vulnerability, etc) while ALSO ignoring the fact that a few Inspirations replaces MoG (defensively) and that your regular powers are actually more effective than MoG is and even moreso when you use a few Lucks.

C'mon, why would one want to Regen their health back when they could just become a gimpy Elude wannabe? That's is obviously better than eating a few Lucks and letting your Regen from the rest of your power fix you up.

The math has been done already on the scrapper forum. Using MoG raises your chances of dying as compared to using your regular powers and/or inspirations.

[DarthMord]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
MoG is great in pvp...I dont see why ever dislikes it...can be great if your a not a [censored]

[/ QUOTE ]

And here I thought trying to outdamage a /Regen's HP recovery was the issue. So very thankful my blaster has AIM and BU......and you CAN'T recover lost hitpoints. Also, so glad that they added the Psy defense back into it..... :)

[/ QUOTE ]

QFT. If you're regen, PLEASE use MOG against me. I promise I won't hit Aim and a yellow insp along with Targetting Drone and kill you in 3 shots with my 30% unresitable damage.

[/ QUOTE ]

And if you want to use MoG as a scrapper, please let me know. My corrupter would like to square off against you. I'll try not to Scourge you. :)

[BurningChick]

[ QUOTE ]
To be fair, MoG is a Scrapper/Stalker power, so we should compare it to similar sets, not gimp Defender sets like Force Fields. ;)

[/ QUOTE ]
40% def with close to 5% more from maneuvers is ... not particularly gimp under def scaling. And that's a big chunk of my point; some sets perform decently while having poor / mediocre 9th (and, in the case of FF, 7th, 8th, and 9th) tier powers.

As for my post comparing MoG to force bubble, I believe the comparison was valid since the guy I was replying to said ... "defensive sets" ... and FF is all bout the def. Had he said "melee sets," well, that'd be different.

But I notice you didn't exactly jump on my comparison to RotP ;)

[Stupid_Fanboy]

it was pretty clear that "defensive" was not implied to mean "DEFENSE" when he said that. The correct comparsion is still between Tier 9 powers available to Melee ATs.

and yes, Self-Rez T-9s have their own special level of hate that is entirely different from the hate that people have for MoG.

[Stupid_Fanboy]

[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]
Pall44, could you clarify what exactly you are seeing? Are you saying that the defense for the power goes away before the icon does? I tested the -regen stuff and that all lines up with the icon blinking perfectly.

[Biostem]

I'm a little confused: if MoG wears off before the blinking icon for it appears, then isna't that a bug? Isn't the whole point of introducing the blinking icon feature to notify you whena power is about to wear off? Are there effects of MoG that we're missing, that actually persist past the perceived end of the power's effect? If not, then this IS a bug & needs to be fixed...

[EvilGeko]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]

Technically, it's not a bug -- it works as designed. The problem is that MoG is the exception to that design. That doesn't help YOU folks at all, it's mainly me straightening out my thoughts on how to approach it. In order for this to be fixed, it will require a code change. So, I'll add it to the queue.

[/ QUOTE ]

Goodness that's depressing. :(

[_mr3_]

hey castle, while we've got the hood open on mog... ;)

[NiteKilla]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking. All the other tier 9 powers are working fine though. Devs, pls fix this, MoG already has enough trouble as it is.

[/ QUOTE ]
Pall44, could you clarify what exactly you are seeing? Are you saying that the defense for the power goes away before the icon does? I tested the -regen stuff and that all lines up with the icon blinking perfectly.

[/ QUOTE ]

No, its worse than that. what happens is the defense AND the resistance goes away BEFORE the warning icon starts blinking. That definatly needs fixing. Thank goodness castle responded.:)

[Bradd]

It's a design defect. That's what _Castle_ was trying to convey: This isn't a construction defect ("bug") but a problem with the design.

[JohnP_NA]

[ QUOTE ]
ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking.

[/ QUOTE ]

Doesn't surprise me.
MoG is essentially the period of def and res, plus the period of no def and res with no regen. So the blink is for the end of the entirity of the MoG effect.

Hence..'working as designed'. It's just that with MoG, that generic design doesn't work, since you want to know when the first part of the power ends, not the secondary.

[SuperSilver]

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OH, and SuperSilver, MoG did NOT have Psy def put back in.

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Oh I know, I meant that as sarcasm.

[Mental_Giant]

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To be fair, MoG is a Scrapper/Stalker power, so we should compare it to similar sets, not gimp Defender sets like Force Fields. ;)

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40% def with close to 5% more from maneuvers is ... not particularly gimp under def scaling. And that's a big chunk of my point; some sets perform decently while having poor / mediocre 9th (and, in the case of FF, 7th, 8th, and 9th) tier powers.

As for my post comparing MoG to force bubble, I believe the comparison was valid since the guy I was replying to said ... "defensive sets" ... and FF is all bout the def. Had he said "melee sets," well, that'd be different.

But I notice you didn't exactly jump on my comparison to RotP ;)

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As someone stated before, when I heard "Defensive" I didn't think "Defense", I thought Scrapper/Stalker/Brute secondaries and Tank Primaries.

40% Defense comes from just 3 powers, however, so I feel safe in calling FF gimp. The number of useful powers in the set is apalling, especially considering the recent mega-nerf to FF's toggle dropping abilities.

And yeah, a Tier 9 self rez is pretty crappy, but that only makes MoG the second worst Tier nine melee defense power.

[Rosenbroch]

Well, the self-rezz Tier 9's are rather useful in PvP!

[Nishnig_Jones]

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And yeah, a Tier 9 self rez is pretty crappy, but that only makes MoG the second worst Tier nine melee defense power.

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I find self-rezzes more useful than a power that sucks in every real-life situation. Fact is, eventually you're going to die and self-rezzes help you get back into the fight faster than going to the hospital without relying on another player. MoG is only useful in a few extreme circumstances that I've never been able to recognize while they're happening. Properly slotting your actual Regenerative powers along with inspiration use is a much more effective way to keep yourself from dying than MoG. It's been said before, I'll say it again, a handful of lucks is far better than MoG any day of the week and twice on sundays.

[EvilGeko]

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And yeah, a Tier 9 self rez is pretty crappy, but that only makes MoG the second worst Tier nine melee defense power.

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I find self-rezzes more useful than a power that sucks in every real-life situation. Fact is, eventually you're going to die and self-rezzes help you get back into the fight faster than going to the hospital without relying on another player. MoG is only useful in a few extreme circumstances that I've never been able to recognize while they're happening. Properly slotting your actual Regenerative powers along with inspiration use is a much more effective way to keep yourself from dying than MoG. It's been said before, I'll say it again, a handful of lucks is far better than MoG any day of the week and twice on sundays.

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I disagree. Clear testing has shown that lucks + normal regen powers is better than MoG FOUR times on Sunday. Your MoG love has got to stop Nishnig! :mad:

;) :p

[Greymist]

I have said it before. My problem with MoG is not that it is too weak (it is but that is not the problem for me) Even before the nerfs when it was good I hated it. Because it is NOT a regen power. It just does not fit the power set. Its kinda like if the SR were getting as a last power a power that would shot off all their defences and five them cap resist. I would not matter if that power was uber or gimped it would not fit the set. Well that is what MoG is.

Please if you are going to have to put in new code anyway. Redo MoG from the ground up.

[_Yuk_]

MoG is the bug! One of the worst powers in the game. In my honest opinion, even jump kick is better!

[Bowfling]

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ok, Ive tested this numerous times, MoG ends BEFORE the warning timer even starts blinking.

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Doesn't surprise me.
MoG is essentially the period of def and res, plus the period of no def and res with no regen. So the blink is for the end of the entirity of the MoG effect.

Hence..'working as designed'. It's just that with MoG, that generic design doesn't work, since you want to know when the first part of the power ends, not the secondary.

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Spot on here. I think the solution might best be handled with two buff icons, One with the positive stuff, and the timer set for those, plus a second icon for the negatives, with the longer timer for those.